Are hydrogen boosters legal?

[hydrodude12]

Hello,

I was recently reading an article on hydrogen boosters, and read that for one to pass a motor vehicle inspection, there cannot be a hydrogen booster or any apparatus of any similar sort attached to the engine, and the engine or vehicle computer cannot be modified in any way.

It was mentioned that you would fail an emissions test if any part of the computer dealing with the oxygen sensor was found to be tampered with. You would then have to either disable or remove the booster to pass the inspection, and not be caught with it in between inspections. Can anyone help clarify this for me? Is having a booster in your car legal or illegal? Are there any known cases where somebody has gotten in trouble for using hydrogen boosters?

Thanks,

-Chris

[Jehu]

I had a little check about this a few years ago and couldn't find squat. I think the best idea is to make sure you don't muck with the sensors. Also if you state that it's a fuel saving device, they probably won't care.

Best bet I would say is to ring up your insurance agency and the people who you have to pay for rego and ask them. Over here it's called the RTA. Dunno what it is in the states.

[AlaskaStar]

Being an I/M Tech (I/M stands for Inspection/ Maintenance) I can tell you that it is illegal, and if you are caught with it, you will have problems. Once a vehicle is certified, it cannot be DE-CERTIFIED, until the Expiration of the Inspection Sticker.

If you bring it in for an I/M Inspection you will fail the VISUAL INSPECTION and the Tailpipe Emission Inspection portion of the inspection will NOT take place.

If you are sneaky enough to hide it to pass the visual inspection (trust me on this one, it's HARD!!! And I know of ways to do it too!), the OBDII test will reveal loads about the sensors. If you are good enough to sneak past that one (Again, I know how...) then, the final test will be the actual 5-gas analysis of the tailpipe emissions. The 5-gas test will be the tell-all.

If you manage to pass the 5-gas, Visual and OBDII Hook-up then you get a "Clean Bill of Health" and the green sticker in the windshield the paper for the jockey-box and a $69 fee to pay.

Now I don't have time to explain all the ways to put in a booster on a 2008 rig and pass an inspection, but I can tell you that it CAN be done.

There are areas of the car that the inspector will NOT look at. There are areas that the inspector cannot see for installing the hose for the hydrogen to the engine. There are ways to 'satisfy' the sensor conditions for the computer and really have something else happening with the engine. The tailpipe Gas Test is the Tell-All.

In the Cert-Test you are given a set of 5 gasses. Two are in PPM, another three in Percentages, and by looking at only those 5 numbers, and no other data given, you have to tell one of the following to be true:

Rich Fuel
Lean Fuel
Low Engine Compression
Stuck Injector
EGR Failure
Plugged Catalyst
Plugged Air Filter
Plugged Fuel Filter
Fouled Spark Plugs
One bank Lean or Rich
Cracked Spark Plugs
Bad Ignition Wires
Bad Cap or Rotor or Both
Wet Plugs
High Water Content in Fuel (liquid Water)
Spark Plug releasing pressure (temperature-caused Leakage)
Plugged Breather
Plugged PCV Valve
Oil saturated in Fuel
Vacuum Leak
Vacuum leak and running Rich
Severely worn plugs
Bad Rings
Stuck Valve
Bad Ignition Coil
Intermittent Spark (Bad Coil Module/Points)
Plugged High Speed Jet on the Carburetor
Sticky Injector
Leaky Injector
EVAP Failure
Charcoal Canister Failure (many ways for this to occur)
Bad Alternator (spark and fuel issues pop up quick!)
TPS Failure
AIT Failure
WTS Failure
Over-cooling by radiator
Under-cooling by radiator
Crack in Exhaust manifold (unseen by the visual check)
Smog Pump operation
Smog Pump Check Valves (Pass/Fail)
Pulse-Air Injection Operation
O2 Sensor function/lack thereof
Brake Booster Failure
Worn Timing Chain
Mass AIR Flow Sensor Operation
Etc...Etc....
and a whole slew of other engine conditions can ALL be diagnosed by looking at the output of a SINGLE 5-GAS Analysis chart, and a person MUST be able to do this to become certified. This is part of the 99% test failure rate.

So knowing HOW to get a booster into a vehicle and HOW to satisfy the computer requirement AND pass the 5-gas test is something you should look into.

It's all available information in books. Hard Copy, made from paper....like Dead Trees....

AlaskaStar

[Dutchdivco]

Following the KISS principle, ya can do what I did; Start off with a <1965 vehicle. No emissions test, no O2 sensor to fool, no catalytic converter, no ECM.So, your vehicle isn't fighting you (or not as much) in your attempts to improve mileage, and big brothers not looking over your shoulder/under your hood and saying "Thats a no-no!"
As an added bounus, usually lots of room under the hood, and elsewhere to put your devices, storage tanks, etc.Jim

[Don]

AS....
in your list of failures to be determined by the 5-gas analysis you have "brake booster failure" listed. Just kinda curious....wouldn't that show as a vacumn leak? How do you determine without further inspection that it is the booster?
Just trying to sponge off your knowledge. My wrenching days for the most part were long before OBDII when you could easily cheat an ECU with a little solder and the proper size resistor or pot in place of a sensor.

Guess we're real lucky here in Florida....no inspections at this time. They talk about it every couple of years though.

I'm looking forward to finally getting my booster done and testing it on my 97 Dodge p/u, it will be interesting to see what needs to be modified to make it work right.

[AlaskaStar]

The vacuum booster/ brake booster- vacuum brake assist unit can fail and generate a vacuum leak. This is evidenced by the NON-MASS AIR FLOW injection systems by a high idle that the computer cannot correct.

The ones with Mass Air Flow meters, are evidenced by a lean misfire under all conditions. I see tons of vehicles that the hose from the MAF to the throttle is not tight allowing air to leak past, causing unsteady idle, lean misfires, and a rough running condition. Make sure it's tight.

The observation for a test (on car) include watching for these things.

So using a 5 gas chart, and a MAF meter type engine, the results would be high O2, high NOx, High HC, and Low CO2, and High CO, indicating a vacuum leak.

A vacuum leak type question would be like such:

Technician A states that High O2, NOx, HC and CO, with a Low CO2, the engine exhibiting a rough idle and poor performance throughout the driving range, can be caused by the EGR valve stuck open.

Technician B states that High O2, NOx, HC and CO, with a Low CO2, the engine exhibiting a rough idle and poor performance throughout the driving range, can be caused by a lean misfire indicating a vacuum leak or lack of fuel flow.

Who is right:

1. Technician A
2. Technician B
3. Both
4. Neither.

The correct answer is Technician B. A stuck EGR valve would exhibit high NOx if stuck closed and a low NOx if stuck open. Technician A needs to stop sniffing tailpipe fumes.

AlaskaStar

[AlaskaStar]

You can check the brake booster without opening the hood:

Apply moderate pressure to the brake pedal, allow any remaining vacuum trapped behind the check valve to escape. Now release the brake pedal and again apply moderate pressure to the pedal.

While holding the pedal, start the engine. If the pedal sinks part-way then it passes the first part. Now release the pedal. Once the pedal returns to the "up" position, allow the engine to run for another 10 seconds. Turn the engine off.

Wait 60 seconds. Press the brake pedal once more. It should feel normal as if the engine is running. Release the pedal after 10 seconds, and press it again.

This last time, it should feel like you are trying to push a mountain with your foot.

If it doesn't pass all this with the proper mechanical results, the booster should be inspected further for failed components such as:

Check Valve

Check Valve Grommet.

Diaphragm

Case Seal

Pedal Plunger Seal

Master Hydraulic Cylinder to brake booster pushrod seal.

Vacuum line failure (cracking, split, stolen....)

Bullet holes.

Drill holes (people installing stereo/ remote starters) from clumsy radio people.

Rust damage.


That is how to check a brake booster of the vacuum type.

AlaskaStar

[Don]

Thanks AS

Manually checking a vacumn brake booster hasn't changed much over the years but I'm not up to speed on the 5-gas analyzer and what a valuable diognostic tool it seems to be.
Even though I was a tech at a dealership and managed a small shop years ago, I feal like a shade tree these days and only work on vehicles for the family and build the occasional race engine for a very select few old budies.

PS...must be a hell of a town where you live if you have to check for bullet holes and stolen vacumn lines.

Don

[tireboy]

[tireboy]

Has any one looked into putting a hydrogen booster/hydroxey gas connected to booster on u can look it up on u tube it pumpes stright hydrogen into your intake increasing hp and torque but more importantly is gas milage for all you road hogs if any one has any comments please submit in this topic